"God's goal is to be All in All, when all are subject to Him. In order to reach this consummation He reveals to His creatures, by numberless object lessons, their utter helplessness apart from Him. Collectively as nations, as well as individually, man is a failure, for the flesh will not be subject to God, nor the spirit give Him the worship which is His due. Adam sinned at the first opportunity, and each of his descendants experiences his own innate incapacity to do God's will. This they are shown in situations of infinite variety, either in this life or in the judgement to come. Thus also with human government and religion. When man congregates, he only emphasizes his Godless impotence. Kings and high priests were never intended by God to fulfill their function perfectly, but rather to fail in order to reveal their futility, so that God Himself will be the only Refuge of His creatures when every other one has disappointed."
~ Concordant Studies in the Book of Daniel (pg. 9 & 10)
I really enjoyed reading this passage because it shows us that without God we are nothing but men coming together to fail. Our leaders aren't here to create a utopia for the rest of us but rather to fail miserably. Once we see that man has and always will fail, only then will we crave God as our only leader. So I guess there is beauty in the breakdown.
Jared,
ReplyDeleteIn the book entitled, "How to Choose a Translation for All It's Worth," the authors outline helpful guidelines for choosing a translation of the scriptures in a particular language.
Based on the principles outlined in that book, which also coincide with my own faculties of reasoning, I do not accept the Concordant Method, nor the Concordant Version of the bible as a viable authoritative source for discussions regarding the interpretation of the Hebrew and Greek scriptures of the Old and New Testament.
The primary reason for this is that the work of translation in the Concordant Version, as far as I can tell, was not performed with the consensus of a group of scholars across the many disciplines required to do an effective work of translation from the original languages, but is rather the work of A.E. Knoch, whose qualifications to do that kind of work are not evident to me.
In light of what I am called to do, I can't spend any more time discussing ideas or teachings that are based solely on the works of A.E. Knoch or anyone else that are not found in the spectrum of English Translations of the bible that are used in english-speaking christian communities that are bearing the fruit of the Spirit , seeking to work in unity with the whole body of Christ in their community, and proclaiming the good news about Jesus and the kingdom of God.
This does not mean that I do not wish to engage in "sharpening" one another through our own personal convictions, but that sharpening, for me, will be limited to English translations of the bible that are in harmony with the principles of choosing a translation which are found in the book I mentioned above.
I do believe that you should reject the use of the concordant translation as being a viable translation of the scriptures and embrace using many translations to avoid the biases of any one individual from influencing the meaning of these texts which become for us the Word of God through our faith in Jesus.
I so appreciate your passion for separating the doctrine of God from the traditions of men. I hope to continue that work together.
In His unfailing love,
Sean
Sean,
DeleteI do appreciate your concern and frankness with me about some of the material I read and research. You are not the first one to express concern nor the last I assume. I know these feelings come from a good heart and for that I'm grateful.
I'm familiar with How To Choose A Translation For All It's Worth. You gave me a copy as a gift many months ago and I read it. However, the principles do not fall in line with my reasoning as it does yours. This is why I do read Knoch's writings along with many other authors that do not have mainstream approval.
When I find an author who writes about spiritual matters I never check his/her qualifications based on man's judgement. Degrees, experience, titles, other works, committees, scholarship, etc. mean nothing to me when it comes to understanding Jesus's message to the world. Jesus, himself, used the most unqualified individuals to relay the message in the first place. There were no committees or group of scholars. There were individuals who listen to Jesus and obeyed him. The Bible is full of examples.
Now, I have never said the Concordant Literal Translation is perfect. Neither did A.E. Knoch. It just happens to be better than every other version I've read, including the so called "Authorized" version. You see, the merits of a version shouldn't be emphasized on who translated it or wrote it but on what it says. I don't follow A.E. Knoch because of him. I read his work based on what it says. Jesus is my leader...not an author. "How tragic, it is, to think of a man more than a man".
Sean, I am not trying to discourage you from reading translations that you feel are necessary to your walk with Christ. I'll never judge you for reading or studying texts that I disagree with. Who am I to say what is correct or incorrect for you spiritual development? You may reject what I read and study which is perfectly permissible.
From here, if you happen to read some of the same materials I read and you find an error in the subject at hand please feel free to let me know. It's fair to say that we will find error upon error in every author or committee. So, if we are trying to find error free authors to follow they do not exist...they are human. Let's be like the Bereans and put the writing to the test, not the authors.
I have read many critical passages regarding Knoch's approach to translating Hebrew, Chaldean, and Greek. At the end of the day they are more critical of his lack of a "committee" than his actual method. If you ever have time to read about his methodology I believe you'll be surprised in the amount of detail given.
Again, thank you for your concern and honesty about this matter. I do know you come from a pure heart when approaching me in opposite beliefs. I know we can agree that Jesus is our Lord and Savior.
My Best,
Jared,
ReplyDeleteI would add that I am practicing this principle myself as I have a 4 volume set of studies from Kenneth Wuest, including his Expanded Translation of the New Testament, which uses as many English words as necessary to convey the shades of tense and meaning in the original Greek texts.
I would not appeal to Wuest's work as an authoritative source alone because it was not done in the context of a plurality of scholars.
Besides the primary issue of it being best to have a plurality of scholars work on a translation of the scriptures, I believe Knoch's concordant method of translation to be errant and misguided based on what I read here:
http://www.scripture4all.org/ISA2_help/Articles/The_Concordant_Method/The_Concordant_Method.htm
"I came to the definite conclusion, which has been strengthened by tests extending over a quarter century of study, that wherever possible, each word in the original should be represented in translation by only one English word. Then the English reader, seeing this English word in all of the correct contexts, subconsciously acquires its exact signification and force and color."
The way I am understanding this, Knoch seems to believe that a single word in the original language should always be translated by the same word in the receptor language.
I simply do not understand how anyone who has studied the process of translation could come to a conclusion like this.
This is simply not the way the work of translation is done. There is much more involved in rendering the meaning of the original text in the receptor language.
The book I mentioned illustrates why this is so in Chapter 2: The Meaning and Task of Translation.
Because I believe the concordant method to be a misguided approach to translation, I would not use any work produced by this method even if there was a plurality of people contributing to the project.
Please let me know if you think there is something I am not understanding correctly regarding the concordant version or method.
In a spirit of respect and concern,
Sean
You bring up a good point of translating one English word for every Hebrew or Greek word. It's been a question of mine as well.
DeleteThrough all of my studies I have come to agree with Knoch regarding his method. At first I wasn't convinced until I tried his approach...especially in the New Testament. It actually translates clearer and without contradictions. This is a method where actual application should be done. Discussing if it is valid or not doesn't do anything for anyone. If a person takes the method and applies it he/she will see a message unfold that is beautiful and crystal clear.
Once again, I wasn't sold on it with a simple explanation from his Concordant Greek Text book. I had to apply it myself.
I believe there is a reason why God chose Hebrew and Greek as the original languages for His message. They are actually very precise compared to other languages. Because we have grown up in a world with confusing meanings of words it's easy to see all written material this way. It's my belief that God chose the languages He did so we could easily navigate through it without having to be scholars ourselves. Yet, it's a catch 22 because we want it to be more complicated than it really is. Simplicity is the highest form of sophistication.
A newer acquaintance of mine is the husband of one of Christie's co-workers at the hospital. His name is Chad, and he teaches Hebrew, Greek, and Latin at Ambrose School where Jeff's kids attend.
ReplyDeleteChad told me the other evening at the chaplain's Christmas party that his students have to study the Greek language for at least two years before attempting a translation of one of the simpler texts from the New Testament in 1 John.
Chad studied Greek and Hebrew at Princeton and may be a good resource to get his thoughts regarding the work of translation (and Knoch's method in particular) as I am at the limits of my ability to explain the technical aspects of translation apart from appealing to the work of brothers and sisters in Christ who have dedicated their lives to such work.